What Cannot Be True
No register was needed for any of these. They are dates in one record that cannot all be true at once — a mother who died before her children were born, a woman married eight years after her own death. Checking a tree against itself is the cheapest research there is, and it had never been done here.
This page exists because of Tereza Pećanić. She is a direct ancestor, and this archive published her as having died before 1850 — while the same record married her in 1858 and gave her children until 1884. Nothing external was needed to see it. Her own page contradicted itself, and it had done so for as long as the site existed.
So tools/consistency.py now reads every person in this archive against themselves and against their own family: births after deaths, marriages before births, parents younger than their children. It finds 63.
By how bad
| Impossible | 33 |
|---|---|
| Very doubtful | 23 |
| Worth a look | 7 |
Impossible means the dates are firm and still conflict. Very doubtful means one of them is hedged — ABT, BEF — so the conflict may be an artefact of the hedge.
By kind
| A child born after the parent died | 25 |
|---|---|
| A parent under thirteen | 16 |
| A child born before the parent | 10 |
| A mother over fifty | 6 |
| Died before being born | 1 |
| Two generations in too few years | 1 |
| Married before being born | 1 |
| Married after dying | 1 |
| Married as a child | 1 |
| Lived past a hundred and five | 1 |
Sixty-three rows are not sixty-three mistakes
Every row above is a symptom. One wrong parent link reports once per child, so the page was counting its own consequences — and worse, it was listing four quite different things as though they were one. Grouping by pivot person and by cause, the 63 rows collapse to 38 distinct mistakes.
| Kind of mistake | Causes | Rows | What it means |
|---|---|---|---|
| A contradiction in the record | 20 | 32 | The dates as written cannot both be true. This is the only kind that is really a finding about the past rather than about the tree. |
| A wrong link | 4 | 8 | Too far apart for any slop in the dates. The join is wrong, not the dates — usually a reused name, or two people merged. |
| A generation skipped | 9 | 14 | The parent is barely older than the child, because a grandparent has been recorded as a parent. |
| Not an error at all | 5 | 9 | A hedged date (BEF, AFT, Maybe) sitting against a firm one. The hedge is doing its job. |
The distinction matters because only one of these four is a finding about the past. A wrong link and a skipped generation are findings about this tree, and a hedged date conflicting with a firm one is not a finding at all — it is the hedge working as intended. Presenting them in one undifferentiated list of “contradictions” overstated the first and slandered the last.
A contradiction in the record — 20
The dates as written cannot both be true. This is the only kind that is really a finding about the past rather than about the tree.
| Who | Rows | The contradiction |
|---|---|---|
| Anna — no page | 1 | born 1809, but Nicolaus Nicolai Kraljich born 1807 |
| Antonia Sestan | 1 | born 11 FEB 1847, died 4 AUG 1846 |
| Antonius Žubrinić Zubrinic Xubrinich | 1 | died 1832, but Catharina born 1847 |
| Budimir Boras | 1 | died 20 MAR 1954, but Vladimira Boras born 1960 |
| Elias Ilija Žubrinić Xubrinich | 1 | died 1845, but Helena Žubrinić Xubrinich born 1847 |
| Hector Defranceschi — no page | 1 | born 22 JAN 1896, married 16 FEB 1835 |
| Helena — no page | 2 | died 1828, but Eva Untersinger born 1839 … and 1 more like it |
| Joannes Ivan Boras | 1 | died 1926, but Blazenka? Boras born 1930 |
| Josephus Josip Žubrinić Zubrinic Xubrinich | 1 | died 1825, but Joannes Žubrinić Zubrinic Xubrinich born 1844 |
| Luka Katnic — no page | 2 | died 10 DEC 1755, but Margaretha Jankovic born 1757 … and 1 more like it |
| Maria — no page | 1 | died 1845, but Magdalena Žubrinić born 1847 |
| Maria — no page | 4 | died 1831, but Stephanus Žubrinić Xubrinich born 1833 … and 3 more like it |
| Maria Catharina Orešković Oreskovic | 1 | born 8 SEP 1835, but Nicolaus "Nikola" Žubrinić (Xubrinic) born 1834 |
| Michael "Mate" Žubrinić / Zubrinic / Xubrinich | 1 | died 1863, but Nikola Žubrinić (Xubrinic) born 1880 |
| Phillipus Žubrinić | 1 | died 1845, but Magdalena Žubrinić born 1847 |
| Vladimira Baricevic — no page | 8 | born 12 DEC 1907, but Andjelika Boras born 1888 … and 7 more like it |
| Hellena Bellobalbic — no page | 1 | born 1868, married 1868 — age 0 |
| Catharina — no page | 1 | born 5 AUG 1784, Joannes Žubrinić Zubrinic Xubrinich born 1844 — age 60 |
| Marica Milkovic — no page | 1 | born 1904, Vladimira Boras born 1960 — age 56 |
| Matia Sekula — no page | 1 | born 1810, Martha Žubrinić Zubrinic born 1861 — age 51 |
A wrong link — 4
Too far apart for any slop in the dates. The join is wrong, not the dates — usually a reused name, or two people merged.
| Who | Rows | The contradiction |
|---|---|---|
| Domianus "Domian" Perpić | 1 | died 1888, but Georgius Prpic born 1962 |
| Ivan de Franceschi — no page | 4 | died 27 MAR 1896, but Anamarija Anisija Franceschi born 1938 … and 3 more like it |
| Maria Sojath — no page | 2 | died 1891, but Georgius Prpic born 1962 … and 1 more like it |
| Gregorius Gregory Žubrinić Zubrinic Xubrinich | 1 | born 12 MAR 1785, died 1896 — age 111 |
A generation skipped — 9
The parent is barely older than the child, because a grandparent has been recorded as a parent.
| Who | Rows | The contradiction |
|---|---|---|
| Anna — no page | 3 | born 1809, Mattheus Kraljich born 1812 — age 3 … and 2 more like it |
| Franciscus Antonio Antonius Defranceschi — no page | 1 | born 13 APR 1785, Mattheus / Matio "Matolin" di Franceschi / Defranceski born 1794 — age 9 |
| Magdalena Žubrinić | 1 | born 21 JUN 1812, Lucas Ugrin Adamich born 1822 — age 10 |
| Maria Catharina Orešković Oreskovic | 3 | born 8 SEP 1835, Daniel Žubrinić born 1837 — age 2 … and 2 more like it |
| Marko Butkovic — no page | 1 | born 1872, Antonija Butkovic born 1880 — age 8 |
| Teresa Grach — no page | 1 | born 1753, Giuseppe / Josephus "Joseph" Defranceschi born 1765 — age 12 |
| Vladimira Baricevic — no page | 2 | born 12 DEC 1907, Zdenka Boras born 1907 — age 0 … and 1 more like it |
| Wolfgangus Volfgangus Adamic Adamich — no page | 1 | born 30 AUG 1813, Lucas Ugrin Adamich born 1822 — age 9 |
| ladislava (lada) bilubaric — no page | 1 | born 11 JUN 1922, ante Boras born 1931 — age 9 |
Not an error at all — 5
A hedged date (BEF, AFT, Maybe) sitting against a firm one. The hedge is doing its job.
| Who | Rows | The contradiction |
|---|---|---|
| Caetano Bacchi | 1 | born 12 January 1779 (Maybe), but through undated Oliva Andreana Bacchi the grandchild Oliva Maria Smojver is born 1781 — 2 years for two generations |
| Antonio de Franceschi — no page | 1 | died AFT 1926, but Bruno de Franceschi born 1939 |
| Joanis Grach — no page | 1 | born BEF 1750, Johanes Grach born 1762 — age 12 |
| Nicolai Žubrinić | 1 | born BEF 1769, Stephanus Stephani Žubrinić Xubrinich born 1769 — age 0 |
| Tereza Pećanić | 5 | died BEF 1850, but Anton Blazevic born 1860 … and 4 more like it |
They are mostly one mistake, made repeatedly
Sort by person rather than by error and the shape appears at once: a woman attached as mother to a family she cannot have borne. Not scattered slips — the same slip, over and over, and almost always to a woman.
| Person | Contradictions | What is wrong |
|---|---|---|
| Vladimira Baricevic — no page | 10 | born 12 DEC 1907, but Andjelika Boras born 1888 |
| Maria — no page | 5 | died 1845, but Magdalena Žubrinić born 1847 |
| Tereza Pećanić | 5 | died BEF 1850, but Anton Blazevic born 1860 |
| Ivan de Franceschi — no page | 4 | died 27 MAR 1896, but Anamarija Anisija Franceschi born 1938 |
| Anna — no page | 4 | born 1809, but Nicolaus Nicolai Kraljich born 1807 |
| Maria Catharina Orešković Oreskovic | 4 | born 8 SEP 1835, but Nicolaus "Nikola" Žubrinić (Xubrinic) born 1834 |
The clearest case is not on the direct line at all
Vladimira Baricević, born 12 December 1907, is entered as the mother of ten Boras children born 1888 to 1911 — nine of them before she was born, one of them in the same month. She is not a doubtful reading or a loose date. She is somebody else's daughter married into the wrong generation, and every child hangs off her.
Which is exactly what happened to Maria Catharina Orešković — four children born when she was two, five and six, plus the son born the year before her. Question 4d worked that one out the slow way, from three parish registers. This check finds the same shape in seconds, without leaving the file.
Seventeen of the 63 sit on people with pages here. The rest are relatives who appear in someone's family list without a page of their own — still worth naming, because a wrong join is visible from both ends.
Dates that are firm and still conflict
| Who | What kind | The contradiction |
|---|---|---|
| Antonius Žubrinić Zubrinic Xubrinich | A child born after the parent died | died 1832, but Catharina born 1847 |
| Budimir Boras | A child born after the parent died | died 20 MAR 1954, but Vladimira Boras born 1960 |
| Domianus "Domian" Perpić | A child born after the parent died | died 1888, but Georgius Prpic born 1962 |
| Elias Ilija Žubrinić Xubrinich | A child born after the parent died | died 1845, but Helena Žubrinić Xubrinich born 1847 |
| Helena | A child born after the parent died | died 1828, but Eva Untersinger born 1839 |
| Ivan de Franceschi | A child born after the parent died | died 27 MAR 1896, but Anamarija Anisija Franceschi born 1938 |
| Ivan de Franceschi | A child born after the parent died | died 27 MAR 1896, but Maja Franceschi born 1941 |
| Ivan de Franceschi | A child born after the parent died | died 27 MAR 1896, but Vjeko Josip Franceschi born 1941 |
| Ivan de Franceschi | A child born after the parent died | died 27 MAR 1896, but Ante Tonči Franceschi born 1944 |
| Joannes Ivan Boras | A child born after the parent died | died 1926, but Blazenka? Boras born 1930 |
| Josephus Josip Žubrinić Zubrinic Xubrinich | A child born after the parent died | died 1825, but Joannes Žubrinić Zubrinic Xubrinich born 1844 |
| Luka Katnic | A child born after the parent died | died 10 DEC 1755, but Margaretha Jankovic born 1757 |
| Luka Katnic | A child born after the parent died | died 10 DEC 1755, but Magdalena born 1768 |
| Maria | A child born after the parent died | died 1845, but Magdalena Žubrinić born 1847 |
| Maria | A child born after the parent died | died 1831, but Stephanus Žubrinić Xubrinich born 1833 |
| Maria | A child born after the parent died | died 1831, but Josephus Žubrinić Xubrinich born 1836 |
| Maria | A child born after the parent died | died 1831, but Theresia Žubrinić Xubrinich born 1844 |
| Maria Sojath | A child born after the parent died | died 1891, but Georgius Prpic born 1962 |
| Michael "Mate" Žubrinić / Zubrinic / Xubrinich | A child born after the parent died | died 1863, but Nikola Žubrinić (Xubrinic) born 1880 |
| Phillipus Žubrinić | A child born after the parent died | died 1845, but Magdalena Žubrinić born 1847 |
| Anna | A child born before the parent | born 1809, but Nicolaus Nicolai Kraljich born 1807 |
| Maria Catharina Orešković Oreskovic | A child born before the parent | born 8 SEP 1835, but Nicolaus "Nikola" Žubrinić (Xubrinic) born 1834 |
| Vladimira Baricevic | A child born before the parent | born 12 DEC 1907, but Andjelika Boras born 1888 |
| Vladimira Baricevic | A child born before the parent | born 12 DEC 1907, but Draga Boras born 1891 |
| Vladimira Baricevic | A child born before the parent | born 12 DEC 1907, but Marija Boras born 1892 |
| Vladimira Baricevic | A child born before the parent | born 12 DEC 1907, but Budimir Boras born 1894 |
| Vladimira Baricevic | A child born before the parent | born 12 DEC 1907, but pava Boras born 1895 |
| Vladimira Baricevic | A child born before the parent | born 12 DEC 1907, but Paulina Boras born 1895 |
| Vladimira Baricevic | A child born before the parent | born 12 DEC 1907, but olga Boras born 1902 |
| Vladimira Baricevic | A child born before the parent | born 12 DEC 1907, but kreso Boras born 1906 |
| Antonia Sestan | Died before being born | born 11 FEB 1847, died 4 AUG 1846 |
| Caetano Bacchi | Two generations in too few years | born 12 January 1779 (Maybe), but through undated Oliva Andreana Bacchi the grandchild Oliva Maria Smojver is born 1781 — 2 years for two generations |
| Hector Defranceschi | Married before being born | born 22 JAN 1896, married 16 FEB 1835 |
Where one date is hedged
A BEF 1850 or ABT 1782 is somebody's estimate. These conflicts may dissolve if the estimate is simply wrong — which is itself worth knowing, because it means the estimate is doing work it cannot support.
| Who | What kind | The contradiction |
|---|---|---|
| Antonio de Franceschi | A child born after the parent died | died AFT 1926, but Bruno de Franceschi born 1939 |
| Tereza Pećanić | A child born after the parent died | died BEF 1850, but Anton Blazevic born 1860 |
| Tereza Pećanić | A child born after the parent died | died BEF 1850, but Marija Blazevic born 1880 |
| Tereza Pećanić | A child born after the parent died | died BEF 1850, but Ivan Blazevic born 1882 |
| Tereza Pećanić | A child born after the parent died | died BEF 1850, but Antonija "Tonka" Blažević born 1884 |
| Tereza Pećanić | Married after dying | died BEF 1850 (hedged), married 21 NOV 1858 |
| Hellena Bellobalbic | Married as a child | born 1868, married 1868 — age 0 |
| Anna | A parent under thirteen | born 1809, Mattheus Kraljich born 1812 — age 3 |
| Anna | A parent under thirteen | born 1809, Stephanus Kraljich born 1817 — age 8 |
| Anna | A parent under thirteen | born 1809, Francisca Kraljich born 1820 — age 11 |
| Franciscus Antonio Antonius Defranceschi | A parent under thirteen | born 13 APR 1785, Mattheus / Matio "Matolin" di Franceschi / Defranceski born 1794 — age 9 |
| Joanis Grach | A parent under thirteen | born BEF 1750, Johanes Grach born 1762 — age 12 |
| Magdalena Žubrinić | A parent under thirteen | born 21 JUN 1812, Lucas Ugrin Adamich born 1822 — age 10 |
| Maria Catharina Orešković Oreskovic | A parent under thirteen | born 8 SEP 1835, Daniel Žubrinić born 1837 — age 2 |
| Maria Catharina Orešković Oreskovic | A parent under thirteen | born 8 SEP 1835, Francisca Žubrinić born 1840 — age 5 |
| Maria Catharina Orešković Oreskovic | A parent under thirteen | born 8 SEP 1835, Maria Žubrinić born 1841 — age 6 |
| Marko Butkovic | A parent under thirteen | born 1872, Antonija Butkovic born 1880 — age 8 |
| Nicolai Žubrinić | A parent under thirteen | born BEF 1769, Stephanus Stephani Žubrinić Xubrinich born 1769 — age 0 |
| Teresa Grach | A parent under thirteen | born 1753, Giuseppe / Josephus "Joseph" Defranceschi born 1765 — age 12 |
| Vladimira Baricevic | A parent under thirteen | born 12 DEC 1907, Zdenka Boras born 1907 — age 0 |
| Vladimira Baricevic | A parent under thirteen | born 12 DEC 1907, Slava Boras born 1911 — age 4 |
| Wolfgangus Volfgangus Adamic Adamich | A parent under thirteen | born 30 AUG 1813, Lucas Ugrin Adamich born 1822 — age 9 |
| ladislava (lada) bilubaric | A parent under thirteen | born 11 JUN 1922, ante Boras born 1931 — age 9 |
Unlikely rather than impossible
A mother of fifty-one and a man of a hundred and eleven are both possible, and both are usually a mistake. These were computed from the first day this check existed and were held back from the page until now, on the thin grounds that they were not certain enough — which is the opposite of how the rest of this archive works. They are published here with their doubt attached.
| Who | What kind | The contradiction |
|---|---|---|
| Gregorius Gregory Žubrinić Zubrinic Xubrinich | Lived past a hundred and five | born 12 MAR 1785, died 1896 — age 111 |
| Catharina | A mother over fifty | born 5 AUG 1784, Joannes Žubrinić Zubrinic Xubrinich born 1844 — age 60 |
| Helena | A mother over fifty | born 25 JUN 1788, Eva Untersinger born 1839 — age 51 |
| Maria | A mother over fifty | born 14 MAR 1793, Theresia Žubrinić Xubrinich born 1844 — age 51 |
| Maria Sojath | A mother over fifty | born 1823, Georgius Prpic born 1962 — age 139 |
| Marica Milkovic | A mother over fifty | born 1904, Vladimira Boras born 1960 — age 56 |
| Matia Sekula | A mother over fifty | born 1810, Martha Žubrinić Zubrinic born 1861 — age 51 |
Two years is not enough for two generations
The checks above compare a parent's dates with a child's — which needs both to exist. Where the generation in between is undated, a contradiction falls straight through. Reading the Karlobag registers turned up exactly that, on the direct line.
| Ahnentafel 214 | Caetano Bacchi, born “12 January 1779 (Maybe)” — the hedge is the tree's own |
|---|---|
| His daughter | Oliva Andreana Bacchi — died 15 September 1795, no birth date at all |
| Her daughter | Oliva Maria Smojver, born 11 March 1781 — confirmed in the register |
A man born in 1779 cannot be grandfather to a girl born in 1781. And Oliva Andreana died in 1795, so she was born well before 1781 herself — her father belongs somewhere around 1730–1745. The 1779 baptism is real; it simply records a different Caetano Bacchi.
It takes two more ancestors with it. Angelo Bacchi (ahn 428) and Catharina (ahn 429) are in this pedigree only because that entry names them as the child's parents. If the baptism is not his, they are not his parents — and Catharina is one of the seven women here with no surname, so nothing else anchors her.
The tool now also walks grandparent → undated child → grandchild and requires at least twenty-four years across two generations. In this archive it fires exactly once.
And it caught three people who are not people
Running the check surfaced four sorting buckets being published as ancestors — 1800-1830 Birth — Selce Papić (Papa) and three like it. The build has always excluded research scaffolding, on the stated grounds that publishing it "would be a lie"; the filter simply did not recognise a name that opens with a year, or one reading Brothers of Casparus (It Seems).
They are gone. (The person count quoted here when this was written, 1,086, has since been overtaken: a surname-fold fix brought 214 more people into the archive.) They had children attached to them, which is how the check found them: a bucket dated 1800-1830 cannot be a parent to somebody born in 1824. What changed →
The twenty “record” contradictions, gone through
The section above sorts the rows by kind. This one goes through the only kind that is a finding about the past, and asks of each what is actually wrong. They collapse further — into five situations and a short list of single slips.
1. Three parents die in 1845 and have children in 1847 — and 1845 is a guess
Elias Žubrinić (d. 1845, child born 1847), Phillipus Žubrinić (d. 1845, child born 1847) and a Maria (d. 1845, child born 1847). Three of the same shape in one family in one year.
That looked like an epidemic. This archive has suspected one since question 4b, because Elias Žubrinić and his wife Ana Untersinger both died in 1845 leaving seven children. Tested, it is not an epidemic.
| Deaths in 1845, whole export | 27 — against a mean of 25.8 for 1820–1880. No spike at all. |
|---|---|
| Deaths in 1845 at a Croatian place | 0 |
| Worst Croatian years | 1875, 1880, 1867 — not 1845, which does not appear |
The reason is in how the dates are written. Six people in this family carry the bare string 1845 — no day, no month, no place, no source: Elias Žubrinić, Ana Untersinger, Phillipus Žubrinić, Martinus Žubrinić, a Maria born 1838 and a Maria born 1809, plus Nicolaus Kraljić. The only two 1845 deaths in this archive that carry a real date — Jelena Katnić on 21 November and Mihovil Kalanj on 13 March — are not in this group at all.
An epidemic recorded in a death register produces days and months. A year applied in bulk produces exactly this. So “1845” here is far better read as somebody's estimate for a group of people who dropped out of the record together — and if it is an estimate, the children born in 1847 are not impossible, merely later than a guess.
This weakens question 4b rather than answering it, and the request to Gospić should now ask a different thing: not “was there an epidemic in 1845” but “when did these six actually die”. A single decade of the Otočac death register would still settle it.
2. The Boras generation, skipped
Eleven rows across four people, and they are one family making the same mistake at both ends of itself: a generation has been skipped twice.
At the bottom. Budimir Boras (1894–1954) and Marica Milković (b. 1904) have ten children. Eight of them — 1923, 1924, 1924, 1926, 1927, 1929, 1930, 1933 — are a coherent set, born when Marica was between nineteen and twenty-nine. The other two are not: Domagoj in 1946 (Marica at 42) and Vladimira in 1960 (Marica at 56, and six years after Budimir died). Those two are almost certainly grandchildren — children of one of the eight — attached to the grandparents instead.
At the top, the same thing. Joannes Ivan Boras, born 1855, is given Vladimira Baricević, born 1907, as his wife, and fourteen children hang off her — nine of them born before she was. A woman born in 1907 is the right age to have married one of his sons, and that is the likeliest reading: she has been put in the wrong generation, and Joannes's actual wife is missing from the record entirely.
One woman in the wrong slot accounts for eleven of the sixty-three rows on this page — which is the whole argument for counting causes rather than symptoms.
3. One typing slip that produced three impossibilities
Georgius Prpić, entered as born 26 March 1962 to parents who died in 1888 and 1891 — reported here as a child born after his father's death, a child born after his mother's, and a mother of 139. His own birthplace settles it: Krivi Put 136, Senj, Lika, Austria-Hungary, a state that ceased to exist in 1918, at his parents' own house. Everything agrees with 1862. What changed →
4. Two that are already open questions
Maria Catharina Orešković, born 1835, as mother of a boy baptised 1834 — this is question 4d, worked out the slow way from three parish registers. And Michael “Mate” Žubrinić, dead in 1863 with a son born in 1880, which is the one man or two question the Gospić letter exists to settle.
5. And six single slips with nothing behind them
| Antonia Šestan | born 11 Feb 1847, died 4 Aug 1846 | Died before born. A one-digit year error, and the archive cannot say which of the two. |
| Hector Defranceschi | born 1896, married 1835 | A marriage attached to the wrong man of the name. |
| Hellena Bellobalbić | born 1868, married 1868 | Married at nought. Almost certainly her parents' marriage year, carried onto her. |
| Anna | born 1809, husband born 1807 — child born 1807 | One of the seven women here with no surname, so nothing else anchors her. |
| Luka Katnić | died 1755, children born 1757 and 1768 | Thirteen years apart. The second child cannot be explained by a posthumous birth. |
| Catharina / Matia Sekula | mothers at 60 and 51 | Possible, unlikely, and unresolvable without the registers. |
So of twenty, three are solved, nine are two family-sized mis-joins, two are questions already open, and six are single slips that need a register. Not one of them required reading a new document — only reading the ones already here against each other.
What this does not claim
- It does not say which date is wrong. When a mother dies before her child is born, either date could be the bad one, and the check has no way to choose. It only says they cannot both stand.
- It does not touch the tree. Nothing here has been edited at source. The contradictions are reproduced, not resolved — the same rule the rest of this archive follows. Method →
- It is scoped to this family. The export carries six family trees; run across all 15,643 people the same check returns 554. Those belong to the other archives, and are their business.